Good morning,
My wife and I are going through a tumultuous few weeks and are wondering if anyone on the board has any advice or experience with this: low-rising HCG levels with conflicting signs.
Here are our facts:
- LMP was 1/12, but cycle length unknown since my wife went off the pill just 2 months prior and had been on it for almost 10 years.
- Conception dates likely 1/28 or 2/1
- HCG Level on 2/14 was 100 (little low but normal)
- HCG Level on 2/25 was 1750 (again a little low but well within normal according to doc)
- Ultrasound on 3/1 revealed a 5-week old sac with embryo but no heartbeat (normal according to doc)
- HCG Level on 3/3 was 2900 (doubling too slowly)
This last HCG level prompted our doctor, who had up until then advised us that things seemed normal and our dates were probably just wrong, to tell us a miscarriage was very probable since the rates didn't increase properly. We spent the last week-plus assuming a misscarriage was coming any time, and we totally lost hope. Basically, we were thinking that way for our own sanity. However, today 3/9, we went for an ultrasound and it revealed a normal 6-6.5 week embryo in a normal sac with a heartbeat at 116 bpm. The ultrasound doctors both agreed it was a normal baby for just over 6 weeks and advised us that the ultrasound was far more reliable at this point than HCG levels.
What do we make of all of this? The HCG levels did not double, yet here we are with a baby that *might* be up to a week behind in development, or might be just fine, but regardless has definitely grown properly over the last 8 days. Any reason for optimism?
Mike
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Name: maria | Date: Mar 9th, 2005 12:27 PM
this chart may help- hcg levels don't double as fast after a certain level (that your wife has passed)..
* For HCG levels <1200 mIU/ml, the expected doubling time is 48-72 hours.
* For HCG levels 1200 to 6000 mIU/ml, the expected doubling time is 72-96 hours.
* For HCG levels >6000 mIU/ml, the expected doubling time is >96 hours. ↑
Name: Mike | Date: Mar 9th, 2005 1:21 PM
This is true Maria, but her rates still hadn't doubled 5 days after her last blood test. Just wondering if anyone had experienced that and still had a healthy pregnancy. Also, given that we know have seen a healthy 6-week old baby, should we ignore or discount those levels? What should we make of them? ↑
Name: PP | Date: Mar 9th, 2005 1:49 PM
Yes Mike I have and my levels not only failed to double on almost every occasion but they also fell 2 times. I too had weekly ultrasounds and actually significant bleeding and spotting for 3 weeks +. I kept a positive attitude and hoped for the best. I am now 21-22 weeks and the baby is doing great. Kicking like a champ and I have my 3D sonogram Monday. I will also tell you that I had miscarried a twin in this pregnancy and my HCG levels were always low. Which I think caused me to have very little morning sickness. Good Luck and keep your chin up that worked for me. We tried for several years to get pregnant and lost many along the way. I will keep you in my thoughts. ↑
Name: Mike | Date: Mar 9th, 2005 1:59 PM
Thanks PP. My wife actually has had no morning sickness yet, and her other symptoms are minimal also, so perhaps the HCG levels explain that.
I am acually going through the samr ordeal as we speak. Except my dates are 5 days behind you. It is really nice to know I am not the only one in this horrible ordeal!!! No one I talked to knew anything. God Bless an Good Luck ↑
Name: Jenny | Date: Mar 14th, 2005 11:23 PM
Hi - today I have been told that my HCG levels have dropped for the second time and I have to have a second ultrasound tommorrow. The first ultrasound was done on the 2/23 and we were told that our baby was 5 weeks (when it should have been 7) it had a heart beat and was in a very good position. I have suffered in the past from having really bad PMS due to low progesterone levels but was told that this had nothing to do with what we are going through - I was wondering if your wife maybe has had bad PMS as well????
All was well until today but we are very optimistic especially after reading PP's Reply to your letter Mike - My thoughts are with you. ↑
Name: Thank you PP | Date: Mar 15th, 2005 4:29 PM
Wow PP, you have given me new hope! My levels are not rising how they should be but are well within range. We haven't got to see the heart beat yet or a baby for theat fact do to my dates being a little offf. We go for our 7 week check up wed and hope to see something. If I may ask you a questiona dn it is kind of graphic but you said you bled for 3+ weeks, was it dark, was there anything in it. It seems that there is something in mine, I am scared it is tissue. I am remaining hopeful and optimistic though and just hoping for the best. Thanks for the inspritation. Kristina ↑
Name: mfawthrop | Date: Mar 15th, 2005 5:34 PM
I went through the same thing my levels were not doubling at 5 weeks and the younger Dr in the practice told me that I had a 66% chance of a m/c. When I saw an older Dr. in the practice he said that once your levels hit 2000 that they don't know when they stop doubling. He said that as long as the u/s were normal that he was not concerned with HCG levels. We have had 3 u/s and everything thus far has been fine. We go for our forth next week. So I would not worry about HCG levels as long as the u/s are normal. Goog luck and I hope that everything turns out okay. ↑
Name: Heather | Date: Mar 16th, 2005 3:08 PM
Thank you all. Today I got my second levels back and they hadn't doubled as fast as my OB would have liked, so back for a 3rd u/s (i'm 9 wks today, saw my bean w/ heartbeat 5 days ago) Spotting to bleeding w/ cramping, it's all very scary. Thank you for giving me a glimmer of hope in this very trying time. *big hugs to all of you* ↑
Name: PP | Date: Mar 16th, 2005 4:46 PM
To Thank you PP: Yes to get very graphic- 1 night it was very heavy with large pieces and most days and nights it was dark red or brown and had small particles in it. I will also tell you that since I had my level 2 ultrasound Monday I am pleased to say that my baby is still very well. Healthy and has all the right parts without extras. They were not able to determine sex. They did say that they thought it could be a girl but the baby was in a very bad position. I think HCG levels are a new study and I think in cases of in vitro they maybe usefull but in my case all they did is make me scared. Think positive and keep me posted. I see the doctor for my 1 lb. bundle. I am also not showing at all and I have only gained about 3 lbs. I can feel it though and I will keep all of you in my thoughts. Mike how is your wife?? ↑
Name: Mike | Date: Mar 16th, 2005 10:19 PM
PP thanks for asking.
Well the odyssey continues! She started spotting a little brown blood yesterday, so we went and got an ultrasound yesterday afternoon. The baby had grown normally for a week, even a little extra, and the bom were up to 144. It's not a 7-7.5 week baby. However, the technicians were still a little concerned because her gestational sac had not really grown since the previous week, and it is too small for the baby's size. We're now wondering whether that size could be related to her slow-rising HCG levels, and frankly we're not sure how to feel. On the one hand we've got a little bit of brown spotting and occasional bleeding now for two days and the gestational sac is too small, but the baby has grown normally now for several weeks and my wife has no cramping whatsoever. So we're about 50/50 right now...trying to prepare ourselves for bad news, but hopeful the spotting will pass and gestational sac is not a big issue.
Does anyoe have any experience with small gestational sacs...is this a very bad sign, or just pause for some concern? And what about brown blood spotting?
Hi PP, well we went to the doctor yesterday and things were not so good. He still could not see anything and the sac appeared to be loosing shape and maybe a little smaller. We are waiting for me to pass it naturally and if I get tried of waiting then have a d & c. I go get blood work done again today, for what reason I am not sure, but it isn;t lookin good. We should have seen something by this point. Thanks for your thoughts and good luck to you, and Mike I wish you and your wife best of luck too. Remember it is in God's hands and everything is for a reason. God Bless you all ↑
Name: Mike | Date: Mar 17th, 2005 1:34 PM
Thanks Kristina. My thoughts are with you...this is certainly a lot tougher than I ever expected.
As for me, my wife is still spotting brown blood a little bit, but no cramping and no clots. We go back for a u/s next week. Hopefully the spotting stops and hopefully the sac size grows appropriately. We're obviously very nervous, especially since the embryo has caught up completely. Such a see-saw. ↑
Name: PP | Date: Mar 17th, 2005 4:44 PM
Kristina- I am sorry your news was not good. I hope that you will heal. I know how hard it is I tried for a long time and had several failed attempts. Please don't give up hope. Mike- I hope your wife is doing well and that both of you are still able to think positively. I went to the doctor today and I am still recieving good news. the baby is head down and my cervix is closed. I am having a girl, Lindsey Grace. It is nice to be able to talk to her and know who she is and what to call her. ↑
Name: Kristina | Date: Mar 17th, 2005 5:27 PM
Oh PP, that is great and Grace is one of my favorite names. I know this is such a see-saw, now I am not bleeding or spotting at all, I just don't know what to think of all of this. I just wish it would go one way or the other. I will keep you all in my thoughts and prayers. ↑
Name: Pat | Date: Mar 19th, 2005 8:35 PM
Hi Mike and all the others. My situation is somewhat similar. LMP was 01/17.First beta count was 69 on 02/18, second was 1000 on 03/03 and the third was 1918 on 03/07. Because this is my second pregnancy, I knew all about beta and it's doubling. Grew very concerned because my levels were not where they should be. Plus, starting passing some very small clots (dark brown in colour). Checked myself into emerg where I was told after a vaginal u/s that I measured 5 weeks with a sac visible but no baby. Was told that baby had not developed passed week 5 and I should be miscarrying soon b/c according to my LMP I should be in week 8. Was scheduled for another ultrasound exactly one week later. That morning I started bleeding heavily and figured I was passing this undeveloped fetus. Well, the sac was holding on but had not grown at all. It still measured 5 weeks. However, a yolk sac had now developed. So, my beta's are way too low, i'm bleeding heavily with lots of cramping, but the sac is developing. The doctors tell me it's an abnormal pregnancy and I will miscarry but can't explain why the sac continues to develop. I have another u/s scheduled in one week. My husband and I had come to grips with miscarriage but now I'm confused. Is there a glimmer of hope or am I just kidding myself? Any advise??? ↑
Name: Kristina | Date: Mar 20th, 2005 11:11 PM
Pat, that is so frustrating. You want to hope for the best but also try to prepare yourself for the worst. I am the same way the sac is growing, my levels aren't rising like they should be, I am waiting to hear my latest result on Monday, he wants to see if they are going up still or falling. I too am bleeding and cramping, but don't want to get my hopes up either to be set up for disapointment again. Just remember everything happens for a reason, and we are not in control. I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers. Hey Mike how is your wife doing, and PP how are you. ↑
Name: Pat | Date: Mar 21st, 2005 9:01 PM
You're right Kristina, everything happens for a reason. Like most, I just want it over with one way or the other. Waiting and wondering is taking it's toll on me!! My next scan is tomorrow morning. Hoping for some closure. Will check in to tomorrow night. ↑
Name: bridgett | Date: Mar 21st, 2005 11:47 PM
Pat and Kristina, It sounds like I am in the same boat with you both. My dates are almost identical to Pat's and I have had 2 vaginal ultrasounds. I have an empty gestational sac which grew since the last ultrasound 1 week prior. My HCG levels are rising (currently 12,000 range). I had spotting and bleeding on and off for two weeks (pink, dark red, clumpy, clotty). My OBGYN has said it is NG. I cried for about an hour and realized there is nothing I could do but to wait for my next ultrasound. Do you trust your doctors judgement or has anyone felt like getting a second opinion? I think my dates might be off by 3 weeks. But the doctor disagrees and thinks I'm in denial. They are ready to do a D&C, but I want to wait it out. Any advice, it's tearing me apart! ↑
Name: Kristina | Date: Mar 22nd, 2005 12:20 AM
Bridgett, I would give it a little while and see if it happens on it's own. I have heard stories where people were scheduled for d&c and on the scan right before the procedure they saw the baby. If you think your dates might be off then wait just a little while to see if anything starts to happen. Figure out with what you think your dated are to about 7 to 8 weeks. At this point you should see something. I know how you feel I cried for about a day, my husband and I cried ourselves to sleep, but really what are you going to do about it. So hopefully things will turn out good for you. I will keep you in my thoughts. ↑
Name: PP | Date: Mar 22nd, 2005 9:22 AM
Please don't rush into a D&C. With this pregnancy was offerd one twice. I really can't tell you but if you can remam healthy and give the baby another week or 2 it could be all the difference. Mine grew leaps and bounds one week. ↑
Name: Shannon | Date: Mar 22nd, 2005 7:35 PM
It was good to read your posts-I had my first (6wks) u/s Monday and saw a geational sac and yolk sac consistent with a 5.5wk pregnancy. My HCG levels at 4wks were doubling normally. My HCG level on Monday was 16,000-The docs said it should be over 20,000-But Maria gave me some insight that after a certain point the levels double every 72-96 hours so I would be normal. I have an u/s scheduled for next Wed, but I already scheduled the D&E for 2 hours after my u/s-I can always cancel, but I didn't want to have to wait to get an appt. like last time-that was misery. You guys have given me a glimmer of hope when before I had none. ↑
Name: Pat | Date: Mar 22nd, 2005 8:26 PM
Well I had my third u/s today and the technician saw absolutely nothing! I obviously miscarried over the weekend. I figured as much since my bleeding was quite a lot on Saturday. My beta count dropped from 5000 (Friday) to 551(Today). I'm actually doing quite well. Cried after my 1st u/s so I guess now I'm just relieved it's over and that my body has taken care of it naturally. I'm going in for blood tests every 3 days from now until my beta count reaches 0. Bridgett--I agree with Kristina and PP--I would definitely wait it out. If the spotting is nothing (which is common), then you should see something new with each u/s. If however, the spotting means you are miscarrying, then why do a D&C. Obviously your body is trying to pass it on its own. I have to say, that not once did a doctor tell me to do a D&C. Every one told me to wait and pass it natually. Less chance of infection and scarring. Do a D&C as a last resort. Good luck to all of you. Maybe next time we will all have a more positive experience and we'll meet up again in a different forum--maybe the one when we complain about morning sickness, heartburn or our inability to sleep because of our huge bellies-- I'd like to thank all of you for your stories and support. It really helped me get though this difficult time. I'll be checking in on you guys once in a while. Keep posting your news!! Goodbye and good luck!! ↑
Name: Jen | Date: Mar 23rd, 2005 9:21 AM
Mike I am in pretty much the same situation as you and your wife. There haven't been any posts from you in a few weeks and I'm hoping that is a sign of good things. My HCG levels are rising only 200 to 400 in a 48 hour period. My baby is growing and has a heartbeat. I've gotten conflicting info from 3 different docs....my next ultrasound is Thursday so I'll post again and let everyone know. Anyone going through the same thing can email me at Jenfer1106@aol.com ↑
Name: Melissa | Date: Mar 25th, 2005 8:47 PM
Hey, I am new here and was reading all of your posts, and let me tell you I can sympothize with alot of you! I am currently 5 weeks 1 day and have moderate bleeding for three days and I am now spotting. I have not really cramped a whole lot, more like a nagging pain! Last tuesday my HCG level was a low 37 and two days later only 44. Very discouraging, but still hopeful. Is there anyone else who has such a low Hcg level that did not double and had a good pregnancy? ↑
Name: Ian | Date: Mar 27th, 2005 12:58 AM
My wife Beverly is 7 weeks LMP. She is pregnant, but things are not looking good. We are told that the sac is too small and her HCG numbers are not increasing appropriately. At 4 weeks (LMP) it was 8. At 6 weeks it was 240, then 760 three days later. Four days after that it was 1650. The latest level is 2900 (4 days later). She has been spotting/bleeding for the last 3 weeks. The sac is 8mm, but the doc says the embryo (no heartbeat visible yet) should be that size at 7 weeks LMP. The doc said she is likely to m/c. We have been trying to get pregnant for 3 years and went through a tubal pregnancy in October of last year. We are not sure what to do next. We have another HCG test scheduled for Monday. They want to do a D&C if something drastic has not happened. Should we hold any hope? Best of luck to you all. ↑
Name: melissa | Date: Mar 27th, 2005 7:13 PM
Ian, I have not been in the same exact situation, but I am dealing with the low numbers and bleeding. I believe there is always hope! Many women have proved there docs wrong & from what I read there's alot a women with low numbers and bleeding that carry on to have a healthy baby. The "Wait and See" game is extremely hard and pressing. Hang in there and your both in my prayers. ↑
Name: Jessica | Date: Mar 28th, 2005 12:33 PM
It is my understanding that your HCG level quits doubling after reaching 1200. It then slows way down, but it still increases. My HCG was low in the beginning, but that heartbeat should indicate that something is going right. Keep in mind that sperm can live for 72 hours or something like that, so fertilization could have occurred 3 days later than you thought. HCG levels are unreliable, and I would act as though you're going to have a baby! Let 12 weeks hit before getting too excited. Most miscarriages happen before 12 weeks. Good luck. You're in my prayers. ↑
OMG! This is the post I have been looking for! I just found this site tonight, and I have been replying all over here. I too have a doctor that has caused me so much stress with what is right and wrong and telling me that I am going to miscarry ect. She never even told me most of my hcg levels ect. All she said was that they weren't doubling. At one point they did a little more than double, but that was it. She had only told us like three times out of the 6 blood tests that I had what the numbers were. And right from that worring about the hcg levels she jumped to how she was pretty sure and worried that this was an ectopic pregnancy and that I'd have to take the Methotrexate to abort the baby! All of this happening starting three days after I found out I was finally pregnant after over a year of trying again. She had gone as far as to set up the day for my u/s and injection right afterwards last Friday. I was a complete basketcase for two weeks! Screaming, crying ect.. The day of the u/s there was the baby in my uterus and NOT in my tubes or anywhere it didn't belong! What a relief that was! But all of that worring for what??? Now, when I went in for that ultrasound last Friday, there was a heartbeat, but only of 97 bpm. So, thus to say she was on the phone to me saying how this isn't good ect....all over again! Today I went in for yet another u/s and there was the heartbeat still going and the bpm are up to 103 in 5 days. I heard that it is suppose to jump like 10 bpm every 3 days. Anyone know if that is right? So, as of right now I haven't spoken to my doctor about this u/s, but I am sure she will call tomorrow with some more negative news on how I will probably still miscarry. I had only one eraser sized spot of blood at the very beging of my pregnancy, and thankfully it never went further. I do have mild cramping, and alot of back pain, but nothing more. I am so thankful I have found this site. I don't feel as alone anymore. I wish this wasn't so hard on all of us...and I am sorry that so many of us are hurting and going through this pain. I myself don't know what to believe anymore, or don't know what to do.... I like all of us just want this baby to be healthy, and to stop feeling so crazy! ↑
